IRC Log Viewer » #firebreath » 2010-10-12

IRC Nick Time (GMT-7) Message
taxilian 09:10 morning, all
amackera 09:10 morning :))
taxilian 09:10 have you solved all of our problems yet?
amackera 09:10 just about
taxilian 09:10 awesome
amackera 09:10 invoice is in the mail :D
taxilian 09:10 hehe
tell you what, you've done so well lately, I'll double what I normally pay you
amackera 09:10 lol
kalev 10:10 taxilian: hey, I was reading yesterday's scrollback and started wondering if BasicMediaPlayerPlugin is doing something wrong when it keeps a shared_ptr to the API class around
taxilian 10:10 no
you can keep a shared_ptr to the API class
just don't keep a shared_ptr to the plugin class in the API
kylehuff 10:10 yeah, it is not polite to point...
taxilian 10:10 lol
the plugin will always get freed before the API class
because it usually has a shared_ptr to the API
so I guess I should say usually will get freed before the API class
if the API class has a shared_ptr to the plugin instead of a weak_ptr, neither will ever get freed
kalev 10:10 yeah, that makes sense
taxilian 10:10 which is what some people would consider a Bad Thing (tm)
kalev 10:10 this is actually great: with keeping a shared_ptr to API around I can be sure in which order these two classes are destroyed
taxilian 10:10 yeah
and by keeping a weak_ptr to the plugin in the API, you can easily throw a script_error exception if something needing to access the plugin gets called after the plugin goes away
bbl, changing places so I can better work on homework
iaincollins 11:10 minor diversion for most of today (spent on one off project back-from-the-dead) ... if nothing bad happens over night back to fb for the next couple of weeks!
taxilian 11:10 awesome =]
iaincollins 11:10 after seeing how easy it was to get something that worked going, have been spending time getting the "customer experience" issues (i.e. installation) polished
taxilian 11:10 yeah, that's always a fun one
installation is, IMHO, the #1 problem for plugins
mainly because there simply aren't any really good solutions
iaincollins 11:10 so have a clickonce "bootstrap" installer for those running MSIE 7/8/9, which gives a nice message and friendly description/logo then handles UAC to run the standard setup installer (which is Google Chrome style "interventionless")
yeah, windows in particular
got the mac one done fairly quick but man is PackageMaker.app a pain (no per user installs!)
at least have horrible real world expereince of doing it on windows (otherwise that would probably take weeks)
taxilian 11:10 why are you elevating privileges? Is there a reason you need admin rights?
iaincollins 11:10 good question, I'm leaving it open as an option for now
we might want to hook it up to a service at the back end, for specific admin tasks (e.g. "fix my wireless")
obviously a big security consideration there though
not needed initially, but something we want to consider as a self service option
taxilian 11:10 *huge* security consideration, rather
iaincollins 11:10 based primarily around the sorts of things our customers call us about, we'd like to have something in place for Christmas
indeed
taxilian 11:10 I'm working on some things that may help you with that
if I get them going in time
iaincollins 11:10 I am planning to not aim for it for October, but maybe for the end of November
background: we also create the AOL UK Setup CD's here (wait; don't kick me! 8).. so we have some appreciation of the issues re: installing and elevating permissions as required
taxilian 11:10 hehe. yeah
the reason that I bring up UAC, though, is that if you're elevating privileges when you don't need to, you are excluding a lot of potential users
iaincollins 11:10 if we did anything like that would build in strict restrictions into the plugin; we have network authentication slated too - so have the option of having a webservice that can confirm a request
taxilian 11:10 and a great many developers don't realize that
iaincollins 11:10 oh for sure!
I'm thinking of leaving it out from at least the first version for public testing just for that reason
(especially as I don't think that version will be doing anything)
from a customer experience perspective it helps slightly in that at least it's all signed and branded (and something they've got from us and are expecting)
taxilian 11:10 yeah, having a controlled userbase makes a big difference
iaincollins 11:10 we have a support offering that's rebranded from a third party (which not very good IMO, if I'm frank)
basically to help users when something goes wrong on their PC or connection, or to help them get answers to questions that would mean calling support and going through lots of settings
often very simple things like bad DNS servers, static IP ranges on the PC where their shouldn't be, trying to connect to the wrong WiFi network (etc)
the thinking behind doing it ourselves (and more for the (now larger here) TalkTalk than the AOL UK brand, although it's the same network now) is that
taxilian 11:10 lol
yeah
iaincollins 11:10 a) we can do it better (the third party software is... gah)
and b) it's easier to manage the support messages, how we structure the content and provided support
so, for example, on our help site we can have "click here if you have this issue and want it fixed"
because for us; really most of the issues are very simple and easier to fix with a script than a call to an offshore call center (between one person for whom English is a second language and another person who is not comfortable running 'cmd' and 'ipconfig')
taxilian 11:10 lol
wow, that's two people in the channel that I don't recognize *in the same day*
awesome =]
sabotaged|wk 11:10 wowzer
taxilian 11:10 welcome
sabotaged|wk 11:10 hi
this project is awesome btw
taxilian 11:10 well, yes
we can't argue with you
;-)
iaincollins 11:10 lol
taxilian 11:10 hehe. glad you like it
iaincollins 11:10 how did you get the cross platform versions done, btw? ... rare to see such great mac support done so early on in a project
okay it's slightly flakey, but I'm huge impressed it works even remotely :)
taxilian 11:10 iaincollins: I did the windows support; amackera is primarily responsible for the excelent mac support
I got it building on mac and linux, but my UI development skills on those platforms are nonexistent
so amackera did all the drawing models and such, all of the things that went into 1.2 for mac support
iaincollins 11:10 amackera: Great job :-)
taxilian 11:10 iaincollins: what we really need is a linux expert to flesh out our linux support
we build on linux, but if you need system (mouse, keyboard, etc) events or drawing you're likely to run into some issues
iaincollins 11:10 I wish I could help with that but probably not going to be able to in that regard as won't be able to spend time to target it offically in our case (just based on our customer profiles and nature of the implementation)
taxilian 11:10 and that is exactly why we don't have it; linux is too difficult to support for too small a userbase for anything not open source
very sad, but nonetheless true
iaincollins 11:10 Yeah :(
The Mac support is good because, although it's only around 5% of our base, I use one anyway, and all our exec's do too
taxilian 11:10 hehe. yeah
I also work on a mac
though I develop primarily for windows
iaincollins 11:10 oh nice, vmware for images?
taxilian 11:10 lately I've been using parallels
but I have used both
iaincollins 11:10 hah same these days (I'm not sure how that happened)
oh really, do you prefer it?
taxilian 11:10 parallels seems to be a little cleaner lately
though some of their upgrade policies stink; I purchased v5, 2 months later they released v6 and told me I could buy the upgrade for $50US
iaincollins 11:10 I had a slight preference for vmware over it initially (and was a safe bet as was happy with it in server land)
ouch
vmware have been nice and given lots of free updates; have been noticing issues with my vmware recently though
taxilian 11:10 I whined, complained, tweeted about it, and mentioned that I would be telling all of my friends, neighbors, coworkers at the little company in CA that I work for (Facebook, in case you've heard of it), etc, and they decided to "make an exception" in my case
iaincollins 11:10 (tends to lock up for periods at a time)
taxilian 11:10 my experience with vmware has been the same
iaincollins 11:10 hmm interesting (and lol)
sabotaged|wk 11:10 can anyone explain how regsvr32 makes it registered as a npruntime plugin? i see there is a mime type registration added in the registry
but that just seems to add a reference to a class id, which would seem like activex
taxilian 11:10 sabotaged|wk: certainly; look at HKCU : Software : MozillaPlugins
also here: http://code.google.com/p/firebreath/source/browse/gen_templates/FBControl.rgs#9
regsvr32 just calls DllRegisterServer on the plugin, which parses the auto-generated RGS file (from the template I just gave you a link to)
that file includes information for installing a registry key in HKCU : Software : MozillaPlugins that tells npapi compatible browsers about your plugin
does that help?
sabotaged|wk 11:10 ah i see, okay. but what links that plugin in MozillaPlugins to the mime type?
taxilian 11:10 the information compiled in from the .rc file into the .dll
string resources
just like if you placed your .dll in the plugins directory
sabotaged|wk 11:10 oh i see so the browser will check all its plugins at startup or whatever and see what mime type they support?
taxilian 11:10 in fact, some versions of firefox (< 3.5) actually ignore the specific filename of a plugin and will find all plugins in the directory of the file you specify there
yes
and any time you refresh a page
sabotaged|wk 11:10 ah ok
taxilian 11:10 and any time you call navigator.plugins.refresh
sabotaged|wk 11:10 that makes sense
thanks
taxilian 11:10 glad to help
let us know what you create with FireBreath; we love hearing about what uses people have put it to
I should probably write a blog post on colonelpanic about that
but right now I barely have time to keep FireBreath going
to all in the channel: If you want to contribute to FireBreath but don't want to write code, the absolute best way you can contribute is to collect answers to poorly documented things (like that one) and put it somewhere on the wiki. Let me know if you need wiki access
also, you can find logs for this channel at: http://logs.firebreath.org
iaincollins 11:10 was just thinking that (and had save it for reference)
oh that's also very handy
sabotaged|wk 11:10 i dont mind adding that info to the wiki if you give me access
taxilian 11:10 gmail address?
sabotaged|wk 11:10 [email protected]
taxilian 11:10 sabotaged|wk: you have access to edit the wiki
sabotaged|wk 11:10 sweet
taxilian 11:10 thanks for helping out
iaincollins 11:10 While you are there could I add a "me too"? ([email protected])
(to save bothering you later)
taxilian 11:10 iaincollins: you should now have access to edit the wiki
iaincollins 11:10 many thanks
taxilian 11:10 trust me, I *love* giving access to edit the wiki (since I'm so bad at it :-P)
iaincollins 11:10 hehe
taxilian 11:10 I'd like it even more if more of the people I gave access to actually used it =]
iaincollins 11:10 :)
taxilian 11:10 we're considering switching to jira and the wiki made by that company instead of using google code's stuff
because a lot of people seem to think that they are much better systems
iaincollins 11:10 oh yes, they are both good
we use Jira here; it's a bit OTT sometimes but it seems to suck the least of all bug trackers I've ever used
taxilian 12:10 yeah, that's kinda the way I see it as well
I may stick with google code's issue tracking still, since it is adequate
but I'm definitely looking into the wiki, because the google code wiki leaves something to be desired
and good docs are critical
iaincollins 12:10 *nod*
I've been very happy reading the Google code wiki, but haven't actually tried contributing to one yet so not sure what the formatting is like
taxilian 12:10 it's not terrible, but I think we can get a lot better
iaincollins 12:10 I wrote the one we use here (I know, what sort of idiot writes a wiki?) just because we wanted very specific functionality
taxilian 12:10 yeah; I've considered something like that, but I figure my time is better spent adding features and fixing bugs on FireBreath
iaincollins 12:10 it's hard to get good document and wiki functionality right I think, as people have very specific wants and needs
indeed
We have a sharepoint system; which in theory is awesome
but in practice sucks (like the rest of them)
so LAMP + TinyMCE + webservice to domain auth to the rescue
taxilian 12:10 most of them are too convoluted for me
iaincollins 12:10 *nod*
taxilian 12:10 elthariel_ and sabotaged|wk: if either of you have not filled out the survey, I would appreciate it if you would do so. I'm getting ready to process the results, and I would really like to have as complete a resultset as possible
I guess that applies to iaincollins as well, come to think of it; not sure if you have or not
iaincollins 12:10 Yeah have done :)
taxilian 12:10 excelent. thanks
I think I'm actually going to put another one up after I take this one down; the answers have been incredibly helpful in planning
iaincollins 12:10 Was thinking about doing it again with unreasonable demands like OpenGL support and seeing how far it goes 8)
taxilian 12:10 lol
that's actually planned
amackera is the resident expert
iaincollins 12:10 Haha, nice
taxilian 12:10 the problem is that there are really only 3 of us that are really actively developing, and we are stretched a bit thin
since we all have our own agendas
in my case, I have my own agenda plus Facebook's agenda to worry about
iaincollins 12:10 It *would* be super fabulous to have a WebGL implimentation; but yeah
Do you have particular things you want to do with it?
taxilian 12:10 well, my personal agenda has more to do with the overall success of the project
it includes getting as many examples as possible, expanding the functionality, and eventually getting things set up to where I can hopefully offer some level of paid support
plus a donations system with some perks for those willing to donate
but with 20 hrs a week working for Facebook and 16 credits at the University, my time is somewhat limited
as we speak, I am working on a algorithms assignment; when I finish it I will write a 4 page paper about it which is due tomorrow
iaincollins 12:10 I will let you get on with that then :-)
taxilian 12:10 I just took a math test, I have a ML programming assignment due tomorrow evening, and my Virtual Machine is due in 2 hours; fortunately I finished that a week ago :-P
hehe. I think I'm okay on time, so if you have questions feel free
I just can't do any coding on FB right now
iaincollins 12:10 I would encourage a domination system; not sure about wider popularity but I regularly drop money to people when I use a library that's particularly handy (often just personally)
taxilian 12:10 domination? you mean donation?
iaincollins 12:10 sorry yes, my typing is awful today
taxilian 12:10 hehe
iaincollins 12:10 especially if it's PayPal (which is varying degrees of evil, but is super-convenient)
taxilian 12:10 yeah, I'm planning on it; my hope is that between that and maybe some lower level paid support options (I'm time strapped, so I can't promise too much) I can get the funds to pay for the server that I will be running firebreath.org off of, which also supports other projects I work on
but I really want to put up something so that those willing to donate get some kind of benefit for having done so first
the initial "offering" will be a web-based fbgen
iaincollins 12:10 I was going to ask at some point if donations will be useful; I'll make a note and if we are sucessful with it see what we can swing :)
taxilian 12:10 sounds good to me =]
donations are always useful; I'd also like to find some way I could spread them out with others who help, though
still working on that
iaincollins 12:10 yeah that can be tricky
taxilian 12:10 Georg/cygmatic, in particular, has spent a lot of time on it and to my knowledge, never gotten paid for any of it.
amackera and I both work on FireBreath at least partially for work
iaincollins 12:10 maybe prominently list key contributers as available for paid support if they interested in that
or maybe a bounty system?
taxilian 12:10 that is definitely one of the things I'm looking into
and that's another =]
but again, time
iaincollins 12:10 I think the bounty system is easy for corporations to justfiy
*nod*
taxilian 12:10 I haven't had time to give much of it real thought
iaincollins 12:10 I wouldn't feel bad bout taking people's money if they want to give it to you as is though :-)
especially if it ultimately allows you to be able to spend more time back on the project
taxilian 12:10 hehe. if anyone is just dying to send me money, I'm happy to give out my paypal email address :-P
iaincollins 12:10 hehe
taxilian 12:10 but I'll try to set up something a little more formal when I can give something back for those who do so
iaincollins 12:10 Okay, it's late here so heading home! (roll on tommorrow!)
taxilian 12:10 have fun
sabotaged|wk 12:10 oops i think i submitted the survey twice
taxilian 12:10 that's okay
we'll dock you a few points for that, but otherwise it'll be fine
sabotaged|wk 12:10 heh
taxilian 13:10 does anyone know of a tool for indexing IRC logs for easy search?
taxilian 15:10 okay, I'm sold; we will be switching to confluence for the main FireBreath page and wiki
amackera 15:10 really?
what convinced you?
taxilian 15:10 I installed it on wiki.firebreath.org
and I like it
a lot
so far
amackera 15:10 ah we used this at work a bit
we switched for some reason to JIRA, which was awful, so then we went to zoho tasks (which is worse)
taxilian 15:10 JIRA is by the same company as confluence
it's just for a differen purpose
amackera 15:10 ah
taxilian 15:10 haven't decided if we will use JIRA for tasks or not
it might be overkill
but you can configure JIRA quite a bit, so I might be able to trim it down enough
amackera 15:10 i don't mind JIRA or confluence, but my bossman thought it was too slow
taxilian 15:10 we will see, I guess
amackera 15:10 yea, it's worth a shot
taxilian 15:10 it will also make the project seem more "real" to people, I suspect
amackera 16:10 sweet
decently performant OpenGL hardware accelerated window/windowless plugins in windows and mac
windowed plugins are screaming fast, windowless are less so (it relies on offscreen rendering and copying the pixels to a DIBitmap & drawing with GDI
)
taxilian 16:10 amackera: so when you try to use opengl directly with windowless, it doens't work?
amackera 16:10 it's just very slow
actually
taxilian 16:10 interesting; so it's faster to render offscreen and blit across?
amackera 16:10 yeah big time
taxilian 16:10 wow
interesting
amackera 16:10 otherwise you're rendering without hardware acceleration
taxilian 16:10 interesting
I guess that makes sense, more or less
is it possible to abstract that in a decent way?
amackera 16:10 sure, you can do all the opengl setup in the window class
since it intercepts all the events
taxilian 16:10 interesting; would be cool to set up a decent abstraction in FireBreath for using OGL
amackera 16:10 agreed
there might be faster ways to do OGL drawing than i've been able to come up with
but some kind of abstraction would have utility, for sure
i'd really like to open source my plugin, i need to discuss it with the rest of the company first though
taxilian 16:10 I keep meaning to ask, but what exactly is your plugin? and where can one download it?
amackera 16:10 the plugin is just basically a drawing api for javascript
i'll send it to you after our release tomorrow for you to play around with
taxilian 16:10 cool
amackera 16:10 truth be told i'm a little hesitant to open source it since i'm a little self-conscious of the code quality
but hey, the worst that could happen is that i learn from my mistakes, :P
IainDowns 16:10 Hi, is anyone out there at this ridiculous time of night?
taxilian 16:10 lol. tell you what; if you open source your plugin, I will personally read all the way through it and see if I can find any problems
nope
we're all gone
IainDowns 16:10 sensible ....
taxilian 16:10 (course, where I am, it's only 16:45)
cygmatic 16:10 yep, nobody here
amackera 16:10 yeah i'm sleeping right now
IainDowns 16:10 Wanted to ask some questions about firebreath ...
taxilian 16:10 you're always welcome to ask questions
amackera 16:10 :)
taxilian 16:10 we might even answer some of them
IainDowns 16:10 OK. I'm in the process of developing a system which will download karaoke files and burn them to a karaoke CD
(don't shoot me I only write the code!)
taxilian 16:10 lol. sounds entertaining
IainDowns 16:10 I've got code which will do the burning part
I've got a web site from which I can download
The problem is connecting the two
what I want to do is to have the user click on a link for a disc they've bought
amackera 16:10 that's actually kind of cool
IainDowns 16:10 and then something pops up which asks which drive they want to use, downloads the file and burns it to the disk
In earlier years, I could get away with something which jkust worked on IE, but not any more!
cygmatic 16:10 hm, wouldn't it be easier to just register your application as the handler for those link types?
taxilian 16:10 he has a point; that might be an easier way to do it
IainDowns 16:10 Well, actually I can't find out how to do that.
Or at least It seems you need to do it differently for each browser
taxilian 16:10 that's if you register a protocol handler;
if you register a filetype
such as .downloadedkaraokecdthingy
then you can install an application and set it to open files of that type
IainDowns 16:10 I'm in the process of registering a vendor mime type with the internet folks
But I could equally use an extension I suppose.
Would that just work?
taxilian 16:10 just like .torrent opens in a bittorrent client
you could have a file that opens in your client that then does what is needed
wouldn't be as "integrated", but it would probably be easier to write
IainDowns 16:10 Yeah, I was going to download a tiny xml file (called .downloaded...) which pointed to the correct url
And indeed, I'm desperately keen to write this in c# rather than c++
Not religion, I just code two or three times quicker!
OK. Thanks. I think you've just unsold firebreath, but maybe saved some of my remaining grey hairs.
taxilian 16:10 hehe
ahh, well
keep us in mind
IainDowns 16:10 I can try that out pretty quickly, though probably tomorrow.
er.
cygmatic 16:10 ok, i haven't ever done registering protocol handlers but there are some apps that have done it already
IainDowns 16:10 Now!
cygmatic 16:10 so it should not be too bad :)
IainDowns 16:10 I *think* it's just a registry setting under the classes tree.
Anyway, guys - thank's muchly.
amackera 16:10 good luck!
IainDowns 16:10 (it's also given me my first ever occasion to use IRC!)
bye!
taxilian 16:10 lol. that was amusing
amackera 16:10 haha, that was strange
taxilian 17:10 http://wiki.firebreath.org/display/documentation/Home
obviously this is far from done
cygmatic 17:10 if just all problems were solved so easily ;)
taxilian 17:10 but so far I'm liking the system
hehe
amackera 17:10 i wonder if browser plugins would work in wine
nitrogenycs 17:10 i've found some posts from a few years ago where somebody was successfully using plugins in firefox in wine
plugins = flash
amackera 17:10 awesome :P
taxilian: the confluence thing doesn't look too bad
taxilian 17:10 there are some plugins that look particularly cool
create yourself an account and you can play with it
amackera 17:10 does it also do issue tracking or is that JIRA that i'm thinking of?
yeah it's JIRA that i'm thinking of
so we'd keep gcode issue tracking
taxilian 17:10 JIRA does issue tracking
but I imagine that they integrate together pretty well
amackera 17:10 yeah
cygmatic 17:10 so i have to ask - what does confluence give us over the gcode wiki?
taxilian 17:10 I'll show you one thing in just a second
though there are several things
this is a much easier to use interface, for one
allows images and attachments much better
better support for code highlighting
support for a blog for announcements
cygmatic 17:10 ok, great
i guess i'll start yet another pdb parser project - i can't find anything free and useful right now for size analysis
taxilian 17:10 :-/
cygmatic 17:10 like apparently many firms we have an internal tool that uses the dia sdk, but i'm not aware of anything useful thats publicly available
taxilian 17:10 http://wiki.firebreath.org/display/documentation/CreatingANewPluginProject
I just created that diagram *in the web interface* in about 5 minutes
obviously it needs to be finished
however, you guys could do some of that, because you can edit it in the web interface
and the license is free for open source projects
amackera 17:10 not bad!
cygmatic 17:10 that looks neat
taxilian 17:10 yeah; I've spent hours looking for a decent UML modeling tool for doing mockups to help people understand the FireBreath class structure, and this has one built in
amackera 17:10 pretty smart idea for a product (this gliffy thing)
taxilian 17:10 no kidding
automatic javascript TOC on the left side
to help people find things quickly
this system is so much better than google code it's almost silly
it'll take some time to move everything over, though
also exports to PDF, word, etc
lots of very nice features
cygmatic 17:10 ok, i'm sold ^^
the dia sdk doesn't look like fun
maybe a map file parser would be faster to write
taxilian 17:10 could be
well, I better sign off and go back to writing a paper
I've spent too much time playing wtih confluence
cygmatic 17:10 good writing
taxilian 17:10 feel free to play with it, guys; move some wiki pages over, make some graphs, etc
if you want to create an account real quick I can make you an admin
currently anyone logged in can edit
cygmatic 17:10 already did
amackera 17:10 i made one already
taxilian 17:10 lol
so you did
didn't check first
amackera 17:10 :P
taxilian 17:10 ok, you are both admins
have fun :-P (but not too much fun)
ttyl
amackera 17:10 is there any documentation on using boost with a plugin?
amackera 18:10 nevermind :)
i was linking an old and busted version of boost, it *just worked* when i stopped linking against it
cygmatic 19:10 taxilian: found something by accident while looking for info... added a link to HelpfulLinks page
this seems to give us all desired information
taxilian 19:10 very cool
found anything useful?
cygmatic 19:10 not quite sure yet
taxilian 19:10 definitely looks useful
cygmatic 19:10 how can i strip log4cplus from FBTest?
taxilian 19:10 remove the "add_firebreath_library" call from the PluginConfig.cmake
cygmatic 19:10 so it just builds differently if that library is not present?
taxilian 19:10 yep
builds NullLogger instead of using the log4cplus logger
cygmatic 19:10 ah, good
and argh @ kvm again
i hate it when it just reduces my resolution to 640x480
taxilian 19:10 :-/
cygmatic 19:10 btw, i recommend to use the Release build and activate "Generate Debug Information" in the plugin project properties
huge size difference to ReleaseWithDebug build
AxIdMap::AxIdMap is rather big for a function
shall i past a dump somewhere?
*paste
taxilian 19:10 you can't debug well with a release, but yes, it should be generating debug info
AxIdMap is big? weird
oh, wait.
yeah, it would be
go look at it
cygmatic 19:10 8.8 kilobyte for those few registration calls is surprising
taxilian 19:10 I don't know that we really need all of those values, though
that function contains a map initialization
cygmatic 19:10 also std::num_get/num_put (i guess from the stream-based number conversions) and the convert_cast stuff add up
the cross-thread-call stuff also adds a bit
still, have a look for yourself when you have time
taxilian 19:10 yeah; if you can paste the dump somewhere that would be great
I can't look at it tonight, though
cygmatic 19:10 taxilian: http://pastebin.com/ypiSeeLm
taxilian 19:10 hmm. so synccallhelper is 10KB, but I think that's worth it for having the functionality
18.29: UnDecorator
wow
cygmatic 20:10 yeah, don't know why this is compiled in
taxilian 20:10 it's a template used with boost::bind, I think
cygmatic 20:10 sure? undname.obj sounds like visual studio debug sdk
although, UnDecorator::composeDeclaration makes you sound right
i'm collecting some stuff into summarized categories
although, actually that info is already there
taxilian 20:10 maybe we can work out a way to make some of the larger bits conditional
there are probably some things we could do to reduce the data size as well
cygmatic 20:10 hm, what exactly could we make conditional?
i'd have to test to be sure, but e.g. if you don't use JSAPIAuto etc. the boost::function stuff should be stripped
if you don't use the convert_cast* templates, they shouldn't even occur in the binary
taxilian 20:10 synchronous calls could be
pretty much all threading stuff could be disabled
taxilian 20:10 however, from what I'm seeing, this means that the binary is about 600KB uncompressed?
taxilian 21:10 I'm actually really excited about this confluence wiki; there is a *lot* we can do with it
we can even put up pages and only give certain people access to it; there are times that would be nice
I also would like to get doxygen or something going on the code
too much to do
cygmatic 21:10 taxilian, on windows it was 741 without log4cplus
would have to build later without it on mac to see if that was the problem
and yes, there is always too much to do ^^
taxilian 21:10 cygmatic: did log4cplus increase the size a lot?
cygmatic: Yeah, comparing the JSAPIAuto page on the gcode wiki and on the confluence wiki, I have to say — it looks *way* better on confluence
cygmatic 22:10 taxilian, hm... maybe make that top bar a little less bright?
taxilian 22:10 lol. I think I can manage that =]
cygmatic 22:10 ah, much less distracting ;)
taxilian 22:10 hehe. I'm lousy at color schemes
you're welcome to tweak it if you want: http://wiki.firebreath.org/spaces/lookandfeel.action?key=documentation
I added a diagram to http://wiki.firebreath.org/display/documentation/classJSAPIAuto
it will be nice when they issue us a license and all the "FREE TRIAL" and "EVALUATION LICENSE" stuff goes away
cygmatic 22:10 nice
taxilian 22:10 so what do you think about the new wiki system? worth the change?
cygmatic 22:10 beside the neat diagrams i don't really see a difference yet
i.e. nothing that would matter much
taxilian 23:10 I find the general formatting to be much nicer
for example, compare: http://wiki.firebreath.org/display/documentation/classVariant vs http://code.google.com/p/firebreath/wiki/classVariant
http://wiki.firebreath.org/display/documentation/classJSAPIAuto vs http://code.google.com/p/firebreath/wiki/classJSAPIAuto
cygmatic 23:10 as i said, in practice it doesn't make that much of a difference :)
what do you think about this: http://wiki.firebreath.org/display/documentation/FrequentlyAskedQuestions#FrequentlyAskedQuestions-Q%3AWhyisFireBreathnotavailableasasharedlibrary%3F
taxilian 23:10 the FAQ item? I think it's needed and well worded
I dunno; to me, the little differences in the formatting make a big difference between being difficult or easy to read
but maybe that's just me
cygmatic 23:10 oops, classVariant is now a child of JSAPIAuto
taxilian 23:10 yeah, should probably move that
still figuring things out =]
cygmatic 23:10 there is a reorder pages link at the bottom
taxilian 23:10 yeah; I'm adding a different home page that will have blog posts on it; that way I can make the sidebar have a "Documentation" section that all the docs will be under
cleaner, I think
cygmatic 23:10 but that looks neat, we could move the reference pages in one subtree, introductory pages in another, etc.
taxilian 23:10 right
the sidebar I think will be a big help long term
cygmatic 23:10 then the class prefix will probably not be needed anymore
yay
taxilian 23:10 yeah
we can also have spaces in the page names if we want
cygmatic 23:10 hm, btw, the link color looks like a "visited" style to me
taxilian 23:10 feel free to tweak it =] I mainly just changed everything from blue to orange; if you have a suggestion for a better color, I can change it. Otherwise I'll look at it in a few minutes
you saw the way I rearranged the page heirerchy?
cygmatic 23:10 yes, nice
and i'm not really good with design either ;)
taxilian 23:10 I particularly like that we should be able to actually seperate all the info into logical different pages
instead of trying to scrunch everything onto the front page
cygmatic 23:10 btw, one easy way to fix markup: put the gcode wiki source in a text editor, use search and replace for " `" to " {{" and "` " to "}} ", then fix the remaining "`" manually
taxilian 23:10 yeah, I noticed you'd been doing that
started doing it myself =]
I have a few vim search/replace strings that make most of the needed changes
:%s/^= \([^=]*\)=/h1. \1/gc
:%s/^== \([^=]*\)==/h2. \1/gc
:%s/^=== \([^=]*\)===/h3. \1/gc
:%s/\[\([^ ]*\) \([^\]]*\)\]/[\2|\1]/gc